Converting to L5R 4e...

[Agasha Taeshik]

I'm trying to work out a way to convert the system as-is into a 4e character sheet. The main obstacle being that the max-player isn't always going to be the max-player, while it IS getting harder to go up in levels, it's still happening... and will for as long as the game goes on. So, the system may end up being a bit more dynamic...

Basically, right now I'm thinking treat each Ring as half for calculating Insight (for calculating individual attributes, you could just split the rank into the 2 sub categories). And using binary for skills (1=1, 2=2, 4=3, 8=4, 16=5, 32=6, 64=7, 128=8, 256=9, 512 = 10, not likely we'll see anyone reach 1,024 me thinks).

This puts the top players at rank 300+ in Insight just in Rings alone, +100ish in skills, for a roughly Rank 11 character... (seems a bit high?)

[Bayushi Senshi]

I know Taeshik and I had a talk about this. We had a much less indepth way of thinking about it. I think we decided that one would have one school rank for every 30 levels? I may be wrong about that...

[tadakasan]

To me, the best answer is kind of a mix of both worlds; Use levels as well as the stats from EE. The way I'm proposing is this; Normally you start off with 40 experience to spend on a character. In this case however you'd get an extra 1 experience per level. So I would start with 178 experience to build my character, while someone level 80 would get 120 experience. Which seems about right (120 experience is what we use in my playgroup to make rank 3 characters normally).

As to what you'd start with, you'd be building from a blank slate obviously... so I think 3 ranks in each of your EE class skills would be a nice start, adjusted by the GM to better fit the skills in game. So in EE an Isawa Shugenja's bonus skills are Art, Lore, Spellcraft, and Meditation. So likely start with Lore 3, Spellcraft 3, Lore: Theology 3, and any one skill at 3 (since an artisan skill seems arbitrary). Then for rings start with one ring at 3 along with the two sub-abilities for it. Probably the one that is highest for the character in EE, but you would have to do something like multiply the Air ring by 2/3rds for a more accurate playing field since air is so much more prevalent than anything else in EE. Which would mean for Tadaka he would start with 3 Fire (3 agility, 3 intelligence).

It's not a perfect system by any stretch of the imagination, but I think it's a system that is fair and accurately translates over. No, it doesn't directly translate skills or rings from EE to the RPG. But that actually makes sense considering the way you build skills and rings in EE are nothing like in the books; I mean, in EE you level skills so you can do jobs, but in the RPG (taking an Hida Bushi for instance), what kind of Crab soldier is going to take meditation, spellcraft, sailing, iaijutsu, and art when they could be spending more on heavy weapons (a skill that doesn't exist in EE anyways).

Anywho, that's just how I would do things; it somewhat crafts the character around your EE character but still gives the player room to make a more realistic and representational character for the RP rather than the bundle of numbers that is an EE samurai.

[Agasha Taeshik]

Senshi: Doing it by levels could be a good idea, but I think the levels would have to be dynamic. Maybe do something with a divisor created from the highest ranking players in the game? The problem with a divider of 30 is that, all the Clan Champions are Rank 3 or if lucky, 4 (and some, quite a bit lower). I'm level 144, at 206k experience (144 comes at 205,920). And that would make me, the 5th highest level character in the game, only level 4. I think our highest level player should be a solid level 10 (no need to go higher than that).

So, if we take the 3 highest level players and use them as a the level 10 targets, we could see that Utaku Mo-Li with her 225,000 experience, would be the base for a Rank 10 character. So, divide your experience by 22,500 to see what level you are..? (This would be SOO much easier/smoother if the sorting by Experience showed levels instead, then the levels would scale better than an experience divisor). Doji Yoshi would currently be level 11 at using such a system...

If we could convince Jay to show levels in the Experience sort (Ie: 206,000 [Level: 144]), we could do a similar thing, but with levels. Which would scale easier and require fewer calcs. And of course, maybe 10 is too high... Maybe we should do it to 8 instead, or maybe even higher, to 12 or something... 3e was hard-set at 8th rank for Shugenja, and suggested for Bushi as well, but 4th edition seemed to accept that people would surpass those ranks...? (Never played 4e, due to the group kinda falling apart before it was released. We quit playing after 3e and never played the d20 version either, which we felt was a huge insult to the awesome game-mechanics of the game in general)

Tadaka: Not really looking to 'build', just a conversion. It's not a bad idea, if I were playing a 4e game locally, but I'm more thinking of for the boards here. Someone told me that my spell casting in the 1 thread I've done it in, was a bit over the top. But, I see myself as the most powerful Shugenja in the game (Isawa Gregory being a possible alternative for that ). Throwing a couple of Rank 5 spells seemed easy to such a character, especially as an Elemental Guard who has a couple of Rank 3 spells he can do as a "Swift" action. So, looking for a way to convert character, as-is, to 4e, to determine just how powerful everyone's character should be.

[tadakasan]

Well, power is more than insight rank, as many people who spend their points poorly in the RPG can tell you. And calculating comparable abilities shouldn't even need to be a calculation as such, since levels are already comparable; without using the 4th edition rules to build characters insight rank itself has no real meaning seeing as there are no school abilities or such to worry about. So in that case simple levels would do without a need for math. Or even xp, though I will say that it would hardly matter if Jay was convinced to allow sorting people by level, since it's not too much different than flat out xp and it'll still only show you the 10 most experienced people.

Otherwise I'm not sure what you're really looking for; converting straight from EE stats to RPG stats isn't practical for multiple reasons. If you still want to that's fine of course, but to what end and what use? Is it going to be for actual rolled and kept dice as such or more of a loose descriptor and power level? Etc.

As a side note, if EE is anything like the RPG, your insight rank is based more or less on your rings not experience earned. So that would mean Fate would be a better indicator than level. Not to mention that rings are what are used to cast spells. So conversion wise, Tadaka is more powerful and a higher insight rank than Taeshik

[Agasha Taeshik]

That's not a bad idea actually. Using Fate instead, making you a Rank 10 since you're in the top 3. Not only does this have a pretty decent cap (once all jobs are to Emerald, only game-stories can raise rings) . I'm assuming you're close to all Emerald?

The only real problem I can see is that "Tainted/Evil" missions calculate into that, which assumes that the only way to be a top-ranking character, is to do those missions as well. And despite the fact we can buy down taint and lose our infamy, I just can't thematically allow myself to do those missions (Like, even though I have 2x the Kadeka Sworn Enemy, I would never conspire against him, so can't touch that mission).

I wonder how much total fate can be accumulated in-game... maybe treat 90% of that as Rank 10 (maximum rank). Doing the evil missions makes it easier to achieve that rank faster, but doesn't make you more powerful in the end sorta thing?

PS. I have no problem with your character being more powerful than mine.

[Agasha Taeshik]

Not that it matters much, but seems each level requires an amount of Experience equal to your current level times your next level, times 10 (so 145 = 144x145x10 = 208,800).

Rings are the same without the x10 multiplier, current ring multiplied by next ring (so 10 to 11 requires 110 in the ring).

[Bayushi Senshi]

Well, if we wanted to know for sure, all we would need to do is test it out, try it each way and put pen to paper see which one looks the most accurate.

I also concur that the fate idea has tons of merit.