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Post by Soshi Kiso on Oct 19, 2011 13:51:26 GMT -5
Poor Takezo *gives a hug*
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Tsi Eri
Oriole Clan
Oriole Clan * Artisan * Samurai * Actress * Daughter of Tsi Karone
Posts: 30
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Post by Tsi Eri on Oct 19, 2011 13:58:36 GMT -5
I think the main question isn't why to follow the champion or not in the context of the setting; I'm understanding Sprinkles question to be "In what context would you let your roleplay decision on the boards to follow what your champion orders (suggests/says) influence the way you vote on matters on the Facebook game?". Or in another way, "In what context would you choose to allow another player's voting choices on the Facebook game influence or dictate the way you vote on matters on the Facebook game?". Which are really completely different questions than anything about the way Rokugan works or the RP politics on the board.
All I can say is, for my part, I never did. Obviously the Tsi don't have any of that, but I know when I was playing a Scorpion I never really let anything said on the boards here influence my votes in game. Same with the Phoenix. Of course, I will say I was always voting "in character", so if my characters hadn't been individualistic it may have been different. Or if my characters had ever been convinced in roleplay on these boards to change their stances, it would have changed the "in character" stance and thus how I voted on Facebook.
And for me it's simply because I find it infinitely more interesting to allow myself to let the character I create dictate my decisions on the Facebook game. If I just did what ~I~ felt like doing, then I would see it as just another clicking Facebook game and probably quit. More or less, it's not the clicking I care about, it's allowing those actions to support who my character is and what she does / believes. That is what turns it from a clicking game into a... well clicking game of Legend of the Five Rings. *giggles* The setting means nothing to me personally unless I am building a character who is within the setting, rather than just me outside of it.
And I can see how others may have similar points of view on the in character aspects of the Facebook game, and allow their character to also be part of who they are in the forums RP here. Thus the connection.
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Post by Shoju on Oct 19, 2011 13:59:22 GMT -5
People think that Homura-san, because I have a big mouth.
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Post by Bayushi Hiromitsu on Oct 19, 2011 14:55:10 GMT -5
I will try to observe the same question from another point of view, if I may:
Just for expressing an opinion different from their champion in a given aspect, a player can experience various types of hassles. Since you can have the most loyal players and your own champion saying "you're playing wrong" or "you could be killed for it" or even being ignored at all by his colleagues ..
Do not think that they are more frequent players who agree with the champion. I just think the others quit the forum.
In the case of the scorpion Another close vote. And finally something that favored the view of the Champion. But notice the opposition with different beliefs.
For this choice. If they had not committed seppuku, the opposition would not have won again? (the lower level characters have less power click)
I actively disagree with even hair color of the champion, not to comment on their attitudes. But even this, I try not to spoil his game.
I try to respect all the players the maximum daimyo, moderator, or not.
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Post by The Blue Ronin on Oct 19, 2011 18:52:17 GMT -5
It's ironic that the Scorpion, the Clan of Loyalty, are probably the most divided of all the Clans right now.
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Post by Bayushi Hiromitsu on Oct 19, 2011 19:55:38 GMT -5
Well... you can say that again, Yoritomo-san. Ah, you can put other things in the list. Lion attacking his lord. Crab leaving the wall. Other things I can't remember. And you can go all the way. The fact is one and only. We are players, not samurai. But what kind of players? Many leave the forum as Koichi-san did. Why they do it?
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Akodo Taiyo
Lion Clan
Lion Clan Hero ? Samurai ? Tactican ? Shireikan ? Honorable ? Loyal
Posts: 196
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Post by Akodo Taiyo on Oct 19, 2011 20:13:32 GMT -5
I don't see how a player can create a great story by just doing what they are told. I guess it comes down to different goals maybe. I'm just not really getting it. So you don't see how a troubled samurai can be torn between his own desires and his duty to his clan? How he must sacrifice what he wants in order to fulfill that duty, or abandon his honor to seek his own desires? There's no possibility for an epic story in there somewhere? If we all took the attitude of "this is just the internet and I can do whatever the heck I want" then we really could just abandon the L5R setting and RP in an imaginary world where duty, honor, discipline, and bushido don't have any bearing on the choices that our characters make. I don't have my character follow my champion just because he's the champion. I do so for some of the reasons I have already given. However, there may come a time when he has to break those ties and go his own way...and that is an epic story that may see the light of day one day in the far future. In the mean time, following his champion helps establish the nature of his character and defines the future conflict he may have to endure if that story ever gets to be told.
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Akodo Taiyo
Lion Clan
Lion Clan Hero ? Samurai ? Tactican ? Shireikan ? Honorable ? Loyal
Posts: 196
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Post by Akodo Taiyo on Oct 19, 2011 20:21:20 GMT -5
What's this about obeying clan champions? Zing!
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Tamori Manji
Dragon Clan Mod
Demon Fox (妖狐)
?Dragon Clan ?Hatamoto ?Fire ?Void ?Yamabushi ?Tattoed ?Nonhuman
Posts: 922
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Post by Tamori Manji on Oct 19, 2011 20:55:38 GMT -5
Just posting to say that I agree with everything Hiromitsu said in his previous posts. Although, the Scorpion is far from being the only Clan with internal strife in the forums.
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Bayushi Senshi
Scorpion Clan
Scorpion Clan * Clan Champion * Samurai * Kensai * Experienced * Loyal * Unique
Posts: 1,891
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Post by Bayushi Senshi on Oct 19, 2011 21:08:50 GMT -5
oh no, you mean to say Manji you don't like my hair either?
well crap.
/me sulks.
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Bayushi Hisa
Scorpion Clan
Samurai * Courtier * Dark Paragon of Will * Loyal
Posts: 479
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Post by Bayushi Hisa on Oct 19, 2011 21:12:25 GMT -5
Going by your hair I cant tell if your power level went over 9000 or you simply licked a light socket...
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Post by sprinkles on Oct 19, 2011 21:43:23 GMT -5
Tsi Eri understood what I was saying. In regards of people saying honor blah blah blah. If your clan champ said we should all get tainted and join the Spider I think some people might have some issues. But the lion attacking their lord (for example) is allowed ever though it's one of the most dishonorable and uncharacteristic actions they could do? I have no problem with votes and such but there are players who vote the way their champion does just because they are the champion. I would think that they would think about what they want then vote that way then if the vote did not go their way obey honorably. That's the difference of ooc and ic.
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Tamori Manji
Dragon Clan Mod
Demon Fox (妖狐)
?Dragon Clan ?Hatamoto ?Fire ?Void ?Yamabushi ?Tattoed ?Nonhuman
Posts: 922
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Post by Tamori Manji on Oct 19, 2011 23:16:31 GMT -5
Should've said it before, but I also agree with the views of both sprinkles and Tsi Eri. Personally, I try to get along with people OOC, despite the occasional provocations and barbs. And I like to separate well what is OOC and what is IC. I prefer to save my IC to the RP threads, so, in all the other threads I act as if I have no specific affiliation, be it to a Clan or to a person. Tamori Manji is definitely loyal to Inari, to the Empire, to the common folk and to the Dragon but my own interests go beyond those of one character and I see no reason to chain myself to his views while OOC (if it was allowed, I would surely play with a character from another Clan here, probably the Spider. Playing "antagonists" can be fun and it would be interesting to play someone who is the complete opposite of Manji).
I also follow, more or less, the same course of action that Eri described. I do in the game what I think is right for my character, given the circumstances I've imagined for him. These decisions can be affected by RP in the forums? Sure they can and, sometimes, when the RP is really good, or people are kind, I'll even embrace other people's causes (be it because I feel it would be "right" for Manji or simply because I want to help my friends. This is mainly why I bear empathy for the Crane here. They were the first Clan I RP'ed with and all of them were very nice). If I have to "obey" people, I would do it because it makes sense in the context, not just because they hold a title (like it was with Koichi. Not only I considered him one of the smart players in the forums but he also was very cool, IC, to Manji. It was only natural for Manji, a young shugenja, to look up to him, even if their time together was short. Which is why I made that farewell topic when he officially left the forums and why Manji still believes, IC, that he is alive and searches for him).
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Kitsuki Yuushahime
Dragon Clan
This person sometimes posts things that are tl;dr
Courtier Magistrate Ambassador Daimyo
Posts: 1,140
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Post by Kitsuki Yuushahime on Oct 19, 2011 23:42:40 GMT -5
Of course they would sprinkles. That is when everyone should declare themselves ronin or vote to denounce the clearly tainted Lord Also, their Lord in their mind is Toturi. This is one of the difficulties of trying to understand mens rea - it is all subjective. Sorry. You can only say that factually the Emperor is the Lion's lord and we just so happen to have two at the moment... And some have obeyed honourably. Senshi isn't attacking the Hantei forces though he originally expressed an interest in it. Takezo left the Dragon. Yuushahime is stuck in her city as she doesn't want to strain the Dragon further with infighting... these are all trying to respect the Clan votes. My apologies that we don't go from "kill the crane!" to "kill the crane's enemies!" but in my mind that would be even more unrealistic. Our Clan might advise and persuade us to declare for someone we don't believe in but that does not mean we have to do everything in our power to support them. Not every Crane will do whatever their Lords want without some scheme in the background. Doubly so for the Mantis or Scorpion. It is all about interpreting orders and being sure not to break one's word while still following your own agenda. That is called being crafty yet still honourable ^_^ or just plain clever
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Post by sprinkles on Oct 19, 2011 23:47:03 GMT -5
Yuusha you don't seem to understand what I am talking about.
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