Tamori Manji
Dragon Clan Mod
Demon Fox (妖狐)
?Dragon Clan ?Hatamoto ?Fire ?Void ?Yamabushi ?Tattoed ?Nonhuman
Posts: 922
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Post by Tamori Manji on Jan 3, 2012 14:36:57 GMT -5
Keisuke-san, as Misaru-san cleverly stated, we are majorly concerned with victory, despite the personal costs. My point is, if the Fire Blossoms action is somehow changed, we should get new actions that require somewhat easy drops (like the ones your side has, not the ones we have that require blowdarts, daisho and such. The items fit very well the mood of the actions, mind you, but they are VERY hard to acquire) and good rewards to balance things out (like heroic opportunities and such. Not warrior monks which has no use at all).
EDIT: Also, as Fitsu-san noted, I am concerned by the Glory/Honor/Infamy involved in all of the war's actions, otherwise I wouldn't even have mentioned this fact. But, as he said, we do what we must (and I'm even seriously considering going down the Stealth/Infamy path).
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quarim
Dragon Clan
Merchant*Qolat*Gaijin
Posts: 334
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Post by quarim on Jan 3, 2012 14:41:09 GMT -5
I recall a time when I was making the same argument on behalf of the Spider at Hiro Hiruma.
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Post by Shoju on Jan 3, 2012 14:54:27 GMT -5
Yeah, the Spider actions for Shiro Hiruma were seriously rare items on a lot of things.
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Bayushi Senshi
Scorpion Clan
Scorpion Clan * Clan Champion * Samurai * Kensai * Experienced * Loyal * Unique
Posts: 1,891
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Post by Bayushi Senshi on Jan 3, 2012 14:55:04 GMT -5
There is a very strong desire amongst the Hantei supporters to win this battle. To say that the strategy to win this does not involve fire blossoms would be a lie. But I am not in the nerf camp.
One advantage Toturi has at this battle field is the self sustaining aspect.
Toturi supporters can earn rallying cries at the battlefield, and in turn use them for more resources. This lengthens the time they can spend at the battlefield without having to leave to find more elixers resources.
Hantei Supporters have no such abilty at this battlefield other then gifts of elixers from friends (I think).
That said, 20k in clicks is insurmountable, 8-12 weeks will turn the lead into 40k-ish imho. Extra actions does not really help Toturi's position here. I do not think nerfing fire blossoms is acceptable, as it is already established.
An idea I do have that can allow a competitive end game sprint for Toturi would be a low cost action, that requires no item as a cost. For example:
Action: Never surrender! "No challenge is insurmountable, fight with your bare hands if you have to!" - Moto Someone. Requirement: Battle 50. Cost: 5 fate. Reward: 3 xp 2 glory.
Why this? its an incentive to fight, good glory gain, and realistically gives the best chances at a fair[/b] fight.
Also I'm rather fond of the idea, I'm a big fan of crushing the underdogs at the end. But I want the underdog to have a good shot at victory. :3
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Daidoji Fitsu
Crane Clan
A prepared Daidoji is an implacable foe on the field of battle. Fitsu is always prepared.
Posts: 311
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Post by Daidoji Fitsu on Jan 3, 2012 15:08:32 GMT -5
5 fate is reeeeeeaaaaaalllllly cheap for an action with no costs and an ubiquitous skill req.
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Bayushi Senshi
Scorpion Clan
Scorpion Clan * Clan Champion * Samurai * Kensai * Experienced * Loyal * Unique
Posts: 1,891
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Post by Bayushi Senshi on Jan 3, 2012 15:14:12 GMT -5
exactly. The intent here is a last minute dash to try to tie things up. The lead will only have increased by the time the action would be added.
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Daidoji Fitsu
Crane Clan
A prepared Daidoji is an implacable foe on the field of battle. Fitsu is always prepared.
Posts: 311
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Post by Daidoji Fitsu on Jan 3, 2012 15:22:40 GMT -5
I see what you're trying to accomplish, but it would probably create an adverse reaction on institution, and again upon completion of the battle regardless of who wins. If the Lion then win, everyone else would feel it was give to them. If the Lion then lose, they will feel it should have been given earlier because they didn't have enough time with it. Admittedly, I am somewhat biased but I'm trying to see how a lopsided action like that could be positive. Doesn't it cheapen the efforts of all the actions already taken by either side?
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quarim
Dragon Clan
Merchant*Qolat*Gaijin
Posts: 334
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Post by quarim on Jan 3, 2012 15:25:39 GMT -5
Either way it's obvious Jay has something planned and has given us a timetable of sorts. It should be fun and interesting.
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Akodo Keisuke
Lion Clan Mod
Lion Clan Regent ?Samurai ?Daimyo ?First Among Generals ?Tactician ?Commander ?Loyal
Posts: 704
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Post by Akodo Keisuke on Jan 3, 2012 15:37:07 GMT -5
It is no longer a 20k climb but a 30k one, and Senshi not exactly sure about you fix either. Round One:ATTACKERS | Know the Terrain | Skirmish with Lion | Assault the Castle | Fire Blossoms | Silent Kill | TOTAL | TOTAL | 6363 (14%) | 10105 (23%) | 5921 (13%) | 19202 (44%) | 1490 (3%) | 43081 |
DEFENDERS | Prepare for Battle | Wall of Steel | TOTAL | TOTAL | 12689 (67%) | 6008 (32%) | 18697 | | | Margine | 24384 |
Round TwoATTACKERS | Skirmish with Lion | Assault the Castle | Fire Blossoms | Silent Kill | Winter Warfare (Dragon) | Iaijutsu Duel | TOTAL | TOTAL | 10105 | 5921 | 19202 | 1490 | 0 | 0 | 36718 |
DEFENDERS | Rally Troops | Wall of Steel | Winter Warfare (Toturi) | Arrival of the Unicorn | Block Supply Lines | Flanking Maneuver | TOTAL | TOTAL | 0 | 6008 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 0 | 6008 | | | | | | | Margine | 30710 |
The self sustaining actions Senshi mentions, requires the following steps: Arrival of the Unicorn 1-2 Light Cavalry orBlock Supply Lines Light Cavalry, Scouting Reports --to-- Flanking Maneuver Light cavalry, Heroic Opportunity --to-- Rally TroopsYou have to farm 2 Light Cavalry, or 3 Light Cavalry + Scouting Report in order to go that get that loop going. It is strong but not as strong as an action that only requires farming one item from an action that that only cost 4 Fate and 1 Koku.
I guess I will have to wait and see what actions come down the road, however in the mean time the advantage still lays with the fire blossoms action, so many clicks were gained in the first round and with it still around as it is still the easiest action to preform at this battle field.
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Tamori Manji
Dragon Clan Mod
Demon Fox (妖狐)
?Dragon Clan ?Hatamoto ?Fire ?Void ?Yamabushi ?Tattoed ?Nonhuman
Posts: 922
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Post by Tamori Manji on Jan 3, 2012 16:09:37 GMT -5
Senshi, no, just no. I gotta agree with Fitsu here. This wasn't done in any other battle, why now? Did you see the Spider get a last minute free action "to spice things up"? Did the Crane get one while defending Toshi Ranbo or LSC? Did the Mantis get one in SWC? None of them did and I don't think this should be done, it's akin to tampering with elections "just for lulz". And, although I do understand the position from which the Lions are speaking, I must say this is not the first time an action is questioned. It happened before, like Quarim observed, and the actions were never changed after being established by Jay. I don't see why this is a special case. As I see it, you guys just want an easier time at catching up to us and a shot at winning. Although that's perfectly understandable, I must say that those 43k votes didn't come out of the thin air and we put a lot of effort into this battle. If that is to be ignored and the rules are to be changed mid game, I want my effort and time investment back
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Post by Shokuma on Jan 3, 2012 16:18:20 GMT -5
It could easily be that with the amount of effort the Hantei supporters have put into the Castle of the Swift Sword, the other battle - Crossroads Castle - could turn into a loss through lack of attention. In a similar manner to the Permission City/Toshi Ranbo pair...
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Yasuki Chad
Crane Clan
Crab Clan
*Crab Clan Courtier *Experienced *Samurai *Daimyo *Hero *Experienced *Commander
Posts: 476
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Post by Yasuki Chad on Jan 3, 2012 16:40:59 GMT -5
I will Take that trade and be happy with it, Shokuma-san.
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Post by Shokuma on Jan 3, 2012 16:43:38 GMT -5
Shouldn't you be weighing in on the battle contest then?
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Bayushi Senshi
Scorpion Clan
Scorpion Clan * Clan Champion * Samurai * Kensai * Experienced * Loyal * Unique
Posts: 1,891
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Post by Bayushi Senshi on Jan 3, 2012 16:46:54 GMT -5
again I'm a hantei supporter :3. Why bring it up here instead of the other battles? Because we have been told that there will be another round of actions here. I'm a competitive guy, I don't like battles being handed out, I like to earn the victory. So knowing that there will be another round of actions, I came up with one that provides a risk to the already insurmountable lead. Thats why I proposed it.
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Akodo Keisuke
Lion Clan Mod
Lion Clan Regent ?Samurai ?Daimyo ?First Among Generals ?Tactician ?Commander ?Loyal
Posts: 704
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Post by Akodo Keisuke on Jan 3, 2012 16:52:53 GMT -5
I just want a level playing field, 30,710 clicks is a lot of ground to cover. Especially when one considers that the lowest fate cost for an action is 17. 19,202 is evidence enough to show that the balance was off on the Fire Blossoms action.
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