quarim
Dragon Clan
Merchant*Qolat*Gaijin
Posts: 334
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Post by quarim on Jan 24, 2012 4:50:39 GMT -5
I understand and sympathize with that completely. I just wanted to point out that the accords of the peace treaty were laid out clearly and in no obscure way. Jay pointed out mechanically how the treaty would affect everyone. It was no surprise that the Crane clicks would not be removed. Likewise the Crane knew they would be prevented from any action against the Lion which included 3 conflicts and were being played.
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Tamori Koichi
Dragon Clan
Dragon Clan * Shugenja * Earth * Void * Yamabushi * Duelist
Posts: 228
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Post by Tamori Koichi on Jan 24, 2012 4:56:18 GMT -5
The problem that I'm trying to point out, however, is that the consequences of a failed attempt by the Dragon to storm CotSS before Toturi arrived were also laid out up front. The former was implemented while the latter was not. Instead of ending up, and I quote, "in serious trouble, caught between a big army and a tough castle," the Dragon were handed a net 6300 clicks from retroactive tally modification. *That* is the inconsistency to which I'm trying to draw attention and the source of my current frustration. The ratio of actions between the Toturi and the Hantei sides right now is 6:6. The initial lead that we had has been equalized. Plus if you would have taken the time to read up, you'd realize that Jay stated this: I retired a couple of the actions that no longer make sense in the current context (Prepare for Battle and Know the Terrain, which were both more about getting ready for the battle), kept others, and added some new ones. A couple more actions will likely be added a little bit later on.
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Tamori Manji
Dragon Clan Mod
Demon Fox (妖狐)
?Dragon Clan ?Hatamoto ?Fire ?Void ?Yamabushi ?Tattoed ?Nonhuman
Posts: 922
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Post by Tamori Manji on Jan 24, 2012 5:04:49 GMT -5
That's exactly my point Koichi-san. And not only that, I cannot see what Kenzo-san says happened anywhere. Nowhere does Jay say that the actions removed will no longer count. Them being removed only means that we can't click on them anymore, it does not mean that their votes disappeared (their votes are even computed in the table posted by Jay in that topic). That said, I do not see where the Lion might've "lost" any votes.
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quarim
Dragon Clan
Merchant*Qolat*Gaijin
Posts: 334
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Post by quarim on Jan 24, 2012 5:10:54 GMT -5
Jay did say that the actions removed no longer counted.
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Akodo Kenzo
Lion Clan
Lion Clan * Bushi * Tactician * Shireikan of the Akodo Army * Ambassador to the Scorpion Clan
Posts: 371
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Post by Akodo Kenzo on Jan 24, 2012 5:11:18 GMT -5
Ok now, please bear with me for a moment because I'm trying to understand what you're saying Kenzo-san, where exactly do you see Jay saying that the Lion lost their votes on the scouting actions? I've read his post again and I can't find that nowhere. And I can't believe its true since Jay does try his best to be consistent. I can only think that there's a misinterpretation here somewhere. The retroactive part wasn't in the main post on the first page. It's found in his followup clarifications on page five: rokuganee.proboards.com/index.cgi?board=news&action=display&thread=1959&page=5For convenience, here's the relevant excerpt: "Force" is calculated based on the total number of clicks on the "Hantei supporter" actions versus the "Toturi supporter" actions PLUS the total of the top 10 scores of the Battle contest on each side. The expired actions (which have been removed) are no longer counted. Old actions that are still there DO count. The new actions added in the 12/29 update count (except for the Battle contest, which doesn't count actual clicks - they count the total of the high scores instead). At some point I will add another round of actions to the mix. Emphasis mine. So now the Dragon are shooting for an easier goal (a simple majority instead of a 3:1 ratio) and select actions are no longer counted towards the final totals, increasing their effective lead by about 25%.
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Tamori Koichi
Dragon Clan
Dragon Clan * Shugenja * Earth * Void * Yamabushi * Duelist
Posts: 228
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Post by Tamori Koichi on Jan 24, 2012 5:14:04 GMT -5
Manji-san, the Lion is correct in that they were removed. The expired actions (which have been removed) are no longer counted. Old actions that are still there DO count. The new actions added in the 12/29 update count (except for the Battle contest, which doesn't count actual clicks - they count the total of the high scores instead). At some point I will add another round of actions to the mix.I realize that the Dragon side has a substantial head start at Castle of the Swift Sword, but it's my intention to give the pro-Toturi side more total actions, representing that they have a better tactical position. So there is the opportunity for victory, if people want to try for it. Naturally, as players, the choice is yours - if the pro-Toturi players (or the pro-Hantei players, for that matter) decide the initial Dragon lead is insurmountable and decide to go do something else, it's totally fine with me. They do not count any longer because as Jay stated they no longer make sense since they're scouting and preparation actions. It was done with a sense of logic, and not just to give any advantage to one side. There will be another round of actions. It's been stated again and again and again.
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quarim
Dragon Clan
Merchant*Qolat*Gaijin
Posts: 334
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Post by quarim on Jan 24, 2012 5:16:41 GMT -5
Kenzo is correct but this was already covered is my point. We've had this argument before. Several actions have been slanted before and not everyone will be happy with them but it's a game enjoy it for what it is. Jay has provided an easy action for the Toturi side and promises more actions to come. It's each players choice to decide how they will act. I'm fighting for my life throwing fire blossums and blowdarting you guys to make sure I win. If I thought I was just going to walk away with it I'd go elsewhere.
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Tamori Manji
Dragon Clan Mod
Demon Fox (妖狐)
?Dragon Clan ?Hatamoto ?Fire ?Void ?Yamabushi ?Tattoed ?Nonhuman
Posts: 922
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Post by Tamori Manji on Jan 24, 2012 5:43:31 GMT -5
Ahh, now I see it, thanks everyone. And yes, I can now understand and sympathize with your frustration Kenzo-san, I would feel the same in your shoes. Although this does cheapen the war effort somehow, I'm with Quarim when he says that we're not taking this battle for granted, that would be the same as to invite defeat. Especially now that the Crane, a Clan with one of the biggest player bases, is barred from participating in the conflict and there's at least another month of conflict ahead of us.
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